Union flag redesign proposed by culture minister

[richard]

The culture minister, Margaret Hodge, has said she will consider a redesign of the union flag to incorporate the Welsh dragon. Her surprising commitment was made in the Commons during a debate on the frequency with which the union flag flies above public buildings. By Patrick Wintour, political editor

The discussions on a new flag design bring a new dimension to Gordon Brown's debate about Britishness.

Hodge told MPs: "The Welsh dragon was not included on the union flag, as the principality of Wales was already united with England by 1606 when the first union flag was created. I can assure all MPs that the issue of the design of the union flag will be considered. As the current flag is formed by merging three heraldic crosses representing the three kingdoms of the UK, the original design was a challenge.

"Thinking of a new design that would meet everyone's aspiration would be an even greater challenge."

Hodge made the concession after complaints from Welsh MPs about constituents not feeling well represented.

Albert Owen, Labour MP for Ynys Mon, said in the debate: "We are all patriots - we are Welsh patriots and British patriots - but we in Wales do not feel part of the union flag because the dragon or the cross of St David is not on it."

The issue was initially raised by Ian Lucas, another Labour MP, who complained that the flag introduced in 1606 following the accession of James VI of Scotland to the English throne as James I combined the cross of St George and the saltire of St Andrew. This principle continued in 1801 when the St Patrick cross was incorporated following the Union with Ireland Act 1800. Lucas claimed the identity of Wales had been suppressed ever since the Act of Union between England and Wales in 1536.

"The three crosses making up today's union flag are the crosses of the patron saints of the three countries represented on the flag," he said. "We could add the cross of St David, but for me yellow and black would not be an ideal design. The recognised symbol of Wales is the Welsh dragon. I would like to see the incorporation of the Welsh dragon on to the union flag so that it would represent the four constituent nations of the UK."


Source
By Patrick Wintour, political editor
http://www.guardian.co.uk/guardianpo...217980,00.html

[Fiona]

In addiiton to the dragon of Wales, think that to truely represent the major "parties" of Britain the new design should incorporate green to represent Bulgaria and the eagle to represent Poland

[richard]

Good to hear from you Fiona, you can be so droll sometimes with your comments, especially as regards which nations should have a chunk of our national flag!

I'm sure Geoff posted something about a redesign of the flag a few months ago but I can't remember which category he posted it under - make me wonder if he knew something we didn't?

I wonder how much this is going to cost the UK taxpayer?

Am quite sure that every politician wants to place their mark on the country, but really, the Union flag, or perhaps the Union Jack is very well known across the world, so why tinker with it?

I really do think we should have a referrendum over this before any changes are made to our flag, because its our country, not some political toy.

Slightly off-topic, should we still be using the following country identifier codes for the country:

• UK - United Kingdom - well are we that united anymore?
• GB - Great Britain - not so much great anymore!!!

Answers on a postcard together with name, address and country

[Geoff]

The question to be asked is "Should the Members of Parliament be redesigned to 'better reflect Britishness and less corruptness'?"

As for MPs' expenses, does it really cost each MP in this country around £90,000 in staffing allowances and £21,000 for travel expenses per year? and what about incidental expenses provision of some £20,000 per year for each and every one of the 646 members of Parliament - and remember this ignores there huge additional expenses claims added on top, it's one great big gravy train for UK politicians looking forward towards becoming an EU funded MEP all of course funded by EU taxpayers!

Most small and medium sized businesses in the UK don't turn over this amount of money let alone squander it on admin expenses.

Frankly I'm disgusted by the number of the snouts in the trough by all members of parliament in all parties. The abuse of taxpayers trust and money by MPs' is quite astonishing.

So will the squandering of money by MPs stop now, or will it take until civil war breaks out that the politicians realise their time is up - and that point in history moves ever closer. Will I save a politician from certain death? no I won't, especially if it's slippery Tiny Blair on health & safety reasons - I'm not getting in the way of anyone that wants to shoot the slimy bas*ard

This huge UK & EU gravy train for the funding of even more pointless politicians & petty bureaucracy has to be derailed NOW.

[richard]

Hi there Geoff, I hear what you are saying and don't think you are alone with your feelings towards MPs being out-of-touch with reality, everywhere I go people are talking about this mass squandering of our money. However please note that not all MPs are milking the system for their own benefit like high ranking benefit cheats, just a few of them.

However, I was quite surprised over the very generous staffing allowance you quote of £90,000 per year per MP. Multiply that by 646 MPs = £58.1million. Might I ask where did you discover these figures?

The UK & EU gravy train for politicians certainly feels like it's going to be forced off the rails sometime soon by a combination of public anger/despair, and the national media who are definitely doing their bit of unravelling excess expenditure by all concerned.

[Geoff]

I found the figs for MP's expenses at http://www.theyworkforyou.com or for a list of MPs http://www.theyworkforyou.com/mps/ select the MP such as Hazel Blears then look below her pic to 'Expenses'.

It's nothing short of scandalous - take a look at the enclosed thumbnail below!

Talking of scandals, how about the £1.4million pension for Speaker Michael Martin